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uninstalled via reboot

(13 posts) (7 voices)

Started 9 years ago by krypteller
Latest reply from krypteller

krypteller
Member

Almost every day, Karl comments on the giveaway of the day. He installs it on his Windows 10 Professional computer. At the end of his daily posting, he writes regularly "uninstalled via reboot." People often wonder what he means by it, why he does that and how he does it.

What does "uninstalled via reboot" mean?
It means that after he is done he reboots his system and his computer will be in exactly the same state as before he installed the giveaway of the day and tested it. A normal reboot will not uninstall anything, but just clear the RAM (random access memory) and some temporary files.

Why is it advisable to "uninstall by reboot"?
If you install a programme on a Windows computer, your system will be changed. The executive and files it needs to run are generally placed in a folder in Program Files. Possibly some are stored somewhere in the Windows folder. Data can be placed in a normally hidden folder, %AppData%. Also entries can be placed in the registry, a huge database. And also data can be placed in %Personal%, that is the My Documents folder of the user installing the programme.
Running the programme can also result in changes in different places.
If you decide you do not want the programme any longer, you can run its uninstaller directly, or via a utility such as CCleaner. But this does not guarantee the state of your computer will be exactly equal, on a bit-by-bit basis to what it was before you decided to download the giveaway. It can be quite difficult to clean your computer fully and it could be necessary to use several 'cleaners' and even manual edits of the registry, %AppData% and %Personal%.
If you install more than 300 giveaways of the day each year (not counting the reruns within the same year), you can end up with a very messy system. And what's more: if any of them is really buggy, it could do havoc to your system and data in the meantime.
It is much wiser to use modern virtualisation techniques that trick your computer into believing you really did install an application while the installation is only virtual. You can compare it to a dream: it seems every bit real to you (including seeing colours), but when you wake up ("reboot") you realise it was all a fantasy.
"Uninstall by reboot" means you have installed and run an application and when rebooting you get your original system back.

How does he do it?
Many years ago I advised schools to install Reborn cards in computers used by students. The students would try and mess up the system completely and some of them succeeded. That meant the student that used the computer after them could not do their work properly. With a Reborn card the changes in the system were rolled back during reboot. That was a hardware "uninstall by reboot".
Karl uses a software solution, by using a programme called TimeFreeze. There are various TimeFreeze programmes available. I like the free Toolwiz TimeFreeze. Wondershare used to have a paid programme. Karl uses a different one: DeepFreeze by Faronics:
http://www.faronics.com/en-uk/products/deep-freeze/standard/
(it would be a perfect giveawayoftheday!)

Posted 9 years ago #
graylox
Moderator

Thank you krypteller for this initiative.

We had this discussion in the past - but it's somewhere hidden on the attic now.
A fresh look at the eligible software is very welcome.

Some more reading about this topic (Freeware only):
What Else Have You Just Downloaded?
Free Windows Desktop Software Security List - Sandboxing / Virtualization

Thanks again.

graylox

03-08-2015

Posted 9 years ago #
KAHSR
Member

Thanks to you both for the info and link(s). I found both emails very helpful :)

KAHSR

Posted 9 years ago #
krypteller
Member

Two other "uninstalled via reboot"-techniques I use:
a) SandboxIE - just empty the sandbox and the system is clean again. During installation and usage the changes are written to a part of the hard disk controlled by SandboxIE. The system itself remains 'pristine'.
b) VirtualBox running a virtual machine. I use a virtual XP Pro that Microsoft gives away to each owner of a Windows 8/8.1 licence. The virtual machine can be kept clean by using a TimeFreezer (double virtualisation) or by stopping the virtual machine and restoring the clean snapshot with a single click.

Posted 9 years ago #
ChrisS
Administrator

Shadow Defender was a GOTD in 2013.

The current version has a 30-day free trial for those interested.

Posted 9 years ago #
KyBunnies
Member

I have always wondered how Karl used a virtual desktop. I would love to do this but I am a novice when it comes to anything techie with my computer. I am scared to change to much. I have very few programs installed.

I currently have a 2 month old laptop and recently upgraded to Win10. So my question is how to I get my computer back to original and install DeepFreeze by Faronics?

I use my computer 10-16 hours a day for work. If I do not have my computer and internet I cannot work. So my main concern is I would mess something up and need to take my computer in and not be able to work. I do not have a back up computer it died and smoking death :)

Posted 9 years ago #
mikiem2
Moderator

FWIW...

Nothing complicated, really...

What if you could preserve your hard drive, so nothing new was ever written to it, yet Windows behaves just like it always has? In theory that sounds pretty cool, because if nothing is ever written to the drive, nothing can ever go wrong. A virtualization app routes every hard drive write to a Virtual Hard Drive [VHD], which is a single file that pretends to be a real hard drive. It also keeps track of what it's written so all of that data, files etc. can be read as if it was really on your physical drive. There are maybe 1/2 dozen programs that do that, & it varies from one to another how you *empty* that VHD storage to put things back, or write that stuff to your actual drive [e.g. when you want to keep the app you just tried]. Some like Karl's empty everything, restoring the drive when the PC [or whatever device] reboots. The app I use, Wondershare Time Freeze, was an old GOTD that's no longer developed -- arguably the most popular is the free Toolwiz Time Freeze [same name -- different software].

That's good for trying out software, but when it comes to protecting you from exploits & viruses & trojans etc., it's maybe 1/2 or 2/3 true -- if a PC had every bit of storage protected, & was not connected to a network with storage or other devices, it might be OK, but if not, don't count on that protection being 100%. Security researchers use specially configured VMs to test, not virtualization software.

There are 2 main downsides to this sort of virtualization software -- it plays man-in-the-middle, so it slows things down slightly, & it requires a driver, so there can be compatibility issues. If you can't save everything when you reboot, that means a lot of software can't be tested this way, & if you record the installation, or otherwise want to preserve something, you have to have some sort of unprotected storage, which can sometimes be a hassle to set up & use depending on the virtualization app you're using.

There are several apps that try to give you close to the same experience as using a virtualization app [e.g. TImefreeze], but use other sorts of tech. Macrium Reflect for example has a feature that restores only the files that have changed since the snapshot was taken, relying on a complete backup written to disk for the source of files & folders. Others expand on the VSS tech that Windows uses for System Restore.

Posted 9 years ago #
ChrisS
Administrator

I currently have a 2 month old laptop and recently upgraded to Win10. So my question is how to I get my computer back to original and install DeepFreeze by Faronics?

There is no need to "get your PC back to original" before installing DeepFreeze. You'd just have to reinstall everything you've installed in the last 2 months. However, you should make a backup before installing DeepFreeze and make another backup after installing DeepFreeze. Keep both backups for a long period of time. If you don't already have a backup schedule then you need to make one based on how much data you can afford to lose. DeepFreeze and similar programs will keep your system "as is" but they won't help if you sustain a catastrophic hardware failure (as you inevitably will).

Note: when making backups it's vital that you test your backup program's recovery media. If it won't boot your system and find your image file then you're wasting your time making backups and giving yourself a false sense of security.

Posted 9 years ago #
mikiem2
Moderator

I currently have a 2 month old laptop and recently upgraded to Win10. So my question is how to I get my computer back to original and install DeepFreeze by Faronics?

As Chris says, don't need to get original -- besides, 10 can't be more than a few days old. And unless it came with a restore DVD, you don't want to... If your laptop had a complete restore image on it, there's a great chance it's worthless, **if** it's still there after the 10 upgrade. That doesn't mean however that it wouldn't attempt a restore, & if that image is incomplete [fairly likely], leave you with a paperweight until you reinstalled 10.

I use my computer 10-16 hours a day for work. If I do not have my computer and internet I cannot work. So my main concern is I would mess something up and need to take my computer in and not be able to work. I do not have a back up computer it died and smoking death :)

**If** you wanted a spare, should run around $80 in the US for a 32 GB Windows 8.1 tablet on sale, or a so-called re-manufactured PC [usually an office PC off lease that's been tested to work]. Otherwise in that situation I'd make backing up a real priority.

Posted 9 years ago #
Keeper
Member

Not impressed with Faronics and the way it sells, or tries to sell, its products. Its website deliberately omits any mention of prices; if you want to know the purchase cost of Deep Freeze Standard, then you have to click on "Order" and are then taken to a page where you're told to choose your country of location from a drop-down list. . . after which, nothing happens. The screen merely states: "Thank you for your interest in Faronics! To ensure that we connect you with the best partner to suite (sic) your needs, please contact us at sales@faronics.eu."

This is twaddle as deceiving as it's pompous. Purchasers don't need "help to connect with a partner." Instead, it's Faronics which wants your help with its email harvesting operation. A company resorting to tactics like this -- and on a pretext that insults a prospective customer's intelligence -- isn't worthy of recommendation.

Posted 9 years ago #
krypteller
Member

Giving an email address is quite common when buying something on the internet. But the business model of Faronics does not cover direct sales. They sell via associates who are free to set their own prices. Nothing wrong with that. The prices can be seen on

https://store2.esellerate.net/store/checkout/CustomLayout.aspx?s=STR1066199390&pc=&page=OnePageCatalog.htm

There is no law forcing British suppliers to sell via internet in my country. I downloaded their trial a few minutes ago. They asked an email address, but accepted a made-up 33mail address. And a fake telephone number. So I can test it for 30 days, before deciding whether or not to buy it. But $45 per year is quite steep, compared to my free alternatives.

Posted 9 years ago #
mikiem2
Moderator

"This is twaddle as deceiving as it's pompous. "

Purely FWIW...

The best way I've found to deal with tech-related companies is to remember that their goal is to make as much profit off me as possible, while my goal is to get the most for the least money, so the whole thing's inherently adversarial -- in the absence of a well developed retail marketing strategy, it can't be anything but. Reality is that there are folks on both sides, buyers & sellers that are idgits, and there are mean, nasty folks, lazy folks etc., just like you find across a random sample of any population. I don't get upset or enthusiastic about any company or seller because experience has taught me it's not worth the wasted energy.

Most businesses are pragmatic, setting rules rather than depending on their employees doing the right thing, while Very successful businesses take buyer manipulation to the highest levels of science. The notable exceptions are many [in my experience most] tech-related companies, especially regarding software. Maybe this is because of the great divide between biz & tech specialists -- I'm sure that has something to do with it, but how much I've no idea.

At any rate I've found that over time they tend to either recognize their impunity under the laws, & push it for all it's worth, or they simply ignore Customer Relations altogether. They may start out very well, e.g. with great CR, but most of the time that simply doesn't last, because short term at least, they find it's not required.

Now as relates to Faronics... Their site is geared for IT rather than individual users/customers, as is their biz. It makes less sense to gather lots of info about a potential individual customer -- more sense to generate corp. &/or gov sales leads, as they're worth sending out a salesperson. krypteller says that they sell through associates, which tells me they're likely not interested in being bothered -- they're set up primarily for big sales, so that makes sense. To say they're pompous towards individuals might well be accurate, but so would saying that they're pragmatic -- they made the decision that their biz model was to go after corp. sales. They're likely like Google, without any real customer CR [corp. salespeople often handle their client CR themselves, as a lost corp. customer means lost income].

How much that matters to any individual user depends on the product as well as its competition. As noted earlier, Wondershare no longer develops TimeFreeze, so I'm in the market for a win10 replacement. I'm willing to pay, but not more than I have to -- besides I only use this stuff Very occasionally. I've made the rounds, doing the initial checkout in my VMs, & so far am leaning towards Rollback RX or Toolwiz Timefreeze -- at the moment Deep Freeze is not in the running. That could change with further testing & use -- I've not yet even set up the test environ.

Posted 9 years ago #
krypteller
Member

You could take a look at Shadow Defender. It was a giveaway on May 1, 2013. A lifelong license costs $35, and "Once registered, you are granted a non-exclusive license to use the Shadow Defender software for your own or your company products submissions on one computer at a time." With some phantasy I infer that I may install it on more than one computer as long as I only run one computer at the time.
I have just installed a 30 day trial on a virtual XP. It seems simpler to use than DeepFreeze.

Posted 9 years ago #

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