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Speech Recognition Software

(17 posts) (5 voices)

Started 16 years ago by Face
Latest reply from RunesageMagik

Face
Member

Does anyone have any experience in using speech recognition software with Windows XP?

I found what looks like an excellent article on the subject:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/setup/expert/moskowitz_02september23.mspx

I have also located what appears to be appropriate and current instructions for installing and configuring the XP system:

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/306537

but since the article was written in 2003, I would appreciate the input of anyone who has used either this system or similar software more recently.

In addition, I have found a half-price offer for Dragon Naturally Speaking 9.0:

https://www.digitalriver.com/dr/v2/ec_MAIN.Entry11?SP=10034&PN=0&xid=19198&trackingid=view-quickbuy&CUR=840

What I need now is the voice of experience. Has anyone used these or any other system and if so, would you recommend one? Has anyone assessed the system that is built into XP for accuracy and speed or compared it to the Dragon or any other software?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

I'm not an expert but I've had a little bit of experience. I had used Dragon with my Macintosh a couple of years ago, don't remember which version but it was either the current version of the time or just one behind, but I found it to be a hassle as I spent more time correcting the mistakes it made than entering my text. I also type around 40-50 words a minute, give or take and found that it was much simpler to just type than to speak and have to correct everything. One has to speak fairly clearly and go through a series of training sessions where paragraphs are read into the program and still it seemed to get a lot wrong. I used the headset that came with it.

Windows Speech Recognition
I have a Dell with XP SP2 now and I explored the XP built in speech recognition when I was experimenting with the TextAloud 'text to speech' software that GAOTD offered a few months ago. I'm not a techie but I managed to set up the speech recognition in XP by following the XP help files. It wasn't real difficult but somewhat time consuming for me, as everything seems to be on these Windows computers. (I don't remember spending nearly as much time troubleshooting my Mac as I do Windows) I used it with my MSWord program and truthfully, I found it pretty much to be the same experience for me as when I used Dragon. (BTW I used my Dragon headset with Windows speech recognition and it worked.) Like Dragon, I had to spend time training it by reading paragraphs to it (not tons of time but enough) and it is supposed to learn to recognize your voice. You even have the option of recording a word the way you speak it. It sounds like Utopia and I was hoping for Utopia. Can you imagine the lessening of Carpal Tunnel if this program functioned errorlessly? Again, it was inaccurate and I spent much time correcting the errors it made. Of course it was a joy when it did accurately type in the words, and occasionally complete sentences, that I spoke. I won't even tell you the different erroneous things it typed when I spoke the word 'dictation.' ;)

It was interesting to set up and play with, if you like that kind of thing, but I found it inaccurate and more of a hassle than not. If your typing is only of the hunt and peck variety, or you have any problems with your hands, or are doing things where errors might not be a big issue, it might be worthwhile for you to use these programs.

For XP, unless you can find a good inexpensive headset (of which I have no recomendations), it might be worthwhile to purchase Dragon because I believe it comes with the headset. The link you posted didn't show me any price but when I went to the product page said you could get the standard version for $99. I don't know if that's the full price or half price. But if you can get it for $50 or less (even used on Ebay which is where I purchased mine) it might be worth it just for the headset, as I believe they can run around $30-50 for a good one (but I'm not really sure on those headset prices as I didn't shop around for one)

I watched the Demo about Dragon and it looks impressive but I believe they've always made those kind of claims, even with the version I purchased, and it didn't perform that well. They claim 99% accuracy, I can't remember what they claimed with the version I purchased, but they claimed it pretty high. Still maybe they have made strides. You might check your library to see if they own it for trying out, some libraries will have actual programs and some only have educational ones. I believe my local library owns it but I haven't gotten around to checking it out and seeing how the newest version functions. If I find the version I was using with my Mac I will post its version number for comparision but I know it wasn't version 9.

I guess I would say to try and set up Windows XP first if you have the time and like fiddling with that kind of stuff. It's really not that difficult to set up (I had the most issues trying to figure out how to get my microphone to function as I had never bothered hooking it up to my Dell) and you'll at least have some experience if you decide to purchase Dragon and need to ask any questions.

Go to your Help and Support and type in Speech recognition. There are several topics listed under 'Pick a task' Look for the topics about Speech recognition and the speech recognition engine, because that needs to be installed in your computer. I don't recall if mine was already there or I had to install it. The other useful tool, also listed under 'Pick a task' is the Language Bar. It displays a 3 icon toolbar on your taskbar, if you want, and on different places (such as the titlebar or with the other toolbars) on the various programs that use it, and allows you to control speech recognition and the 'text to speech' functions.

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

Face, I've been using Dragon Pro for about 15 years, both on Win95 and WinXP. Benefits aren't always quantifiable. There's -
a) comfort- I never was big on posture (feet on floor, sit up straight) so, with this I can fidget, walk around and stretch, play with the cat, all without breaking my train of thought;
b) reduced hassle- I type 80-100 wpm when writing articles, but still only hunt and peck numbers. Dragon's greatly improved its integration with Microsoft products (even Bookshelf), so I can quickly and accurately fill in spreadsheet cells while scrutinizing invoices scattered over my desk, or effortlessly copy dictated script from Dragonpad to Word (to proof it) and then on to Publisher or PowerPoint. Unfortunately, it's not compatible with Adobe PS; so as a workaround I dictate ad copy in Word, copy/paste the text into an Adobe project, and dictate the specs (font, size, leading, etc.) into a sidebar in Word for future reference without lifting a finger.

Dragon eliminates dozens of minor hassles. I glance at a confusing weekend sales circular and dictate items/prices to a shopping list. I verbally copy/paste error message pop-ups, passwords or snippets of text from business cards, brochures, whatever. No more losing my place with a book that refuses to stay open or a complex table of stock price data. As I grow older, my personal/professional vocabularies continue to expand, but my eyesight and spelling proficiency wane. Dragon always knows when to use i before e. I can teach it an arcane medical term, a 3rd world politicians' 9-consonants-in-a-row polysyllabic surname, botanical names such as callicarpa dichotoma or leucothoe fontanesiana, a colloquial expression, and it remembers! Sure, my declining spelling skills can be partly attributed to that very convenience (as well as to spell checkers), but what the heck; the 2% of my aging brain cells that croak each year ain't helping matters, either!

I initially chose Dragon based on the above-average reviews. To avoid bankruptcy, I tend to leapfrog upgrades (ala Adobe and Microsoft) that are cranked out like expensive Pez candy, so am content for now with version 7.30 (about $50 via an Amazon reseller last year because it was brand new but considered "out of date") BEWARE the advertised rebate on Amazon - I believe it's only applicable if you're upgrading. As I recall, reviews for the next gen v8 weren't as good; that helped push me to the older version. Don't know about v9 and your link didn't work so I couldn't tell what you were looking at. If you can get the v9 Dragon Preferred (the "Preferred" rather than the super expensive PRO) for half price (say <$100), that's pretty good. IMHO, it's a great buy IF you're serious about writing, or numbers key-challenged like me. All in all I've been very pleased. Tech-support was never great, but that shouldn't surprise considering the low price for such a powerful voice recognition product. My biggest beef came some years ago when a major revision employing a new algorithm required me to retrain my custom 7k word dictionary. grrrrrr

As with chess and karate, it only takes a few minutes to learn the basics, much longer (though not a lifetime) to master. You should approach voice-recognition software the way you would hiring a key employee with whom you'll be working very closely (err, an administrative assistant, not the cute little intern with the tight...) You have to learn their idiosyncrasies and they have to learn yours before things work smoothly. Once the basic dictation commands become second nature and Dragon learns how to spell the words you use most often, typing demands and interruptions decline markedly.

I've always found Dragon's "read back" function useless... artificial voices still suck for most speech-recognition software and AI still takes sentence structure way too literally. The larger your vocabulary the more often you're likely to have to stop and train the system, though I noticed my upgraded Dragon version had noticeably deeper vocabulary and grammatical skills. I believe you can purchase word modules applicable to specific professions, i.e. legal and medical to make training easier.

Tips: If you suffer postnasal drip or other allergies, take a pill before doing any serious dictation. Transcription can go pretty smoothly, but free associative speaking can be stressful because of the extra proofing required. If nothing else, the software will improve your enunciation and your ability to focus... or, you'll put your foot through the monitor. Depends on your tolerance level.

I currently use an inexpensive Labtec microphone that easily slips around my neck, as I don't use the earpiece part. I usually keep the mouse in one hand to skip the more convoluted cursor commands.

Note- this message was created using Dragon and I only did a cursory visual edit with one cup of coffee in me. Find many mistakes?

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

Ooops, shame on me for saying "voice recognition". Totally different animal.

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

Face, I have looked up and found the software I had been using and unfortunately I gave the incorrect title. The product I was using was ViaVoice Enhanced Edition. It had been over two years since my Macintosh has functioned. I am sorry for giving the incorrect title, but the info/experience I left for Windows XP's speech recognition is only from a few months ago. Reading RunesageMagi's review for Dragon though, maybe I will give XP's speech recognition a little more work and if it doesn't get any better, I will search out a trial copy of Dragon and see if it works any better than ViaVoice or XP. At the time I purchased ViaVoice though, I had determined by reading many reviews that it was the best candidate of available softwares for speech recognition. Maybe that has changed. Maybe all the titles work better on Windows, who knows.

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

RunesageMagi, if you are still reading,

Thank you for your input on Dragon. I have a couple of questions. You said you have been using Dragon for 15 years. How long did it take using this program for things to become second nature? I am assuming you have upgraded often. How long did it take you to train Dragon to perform well enough that you only had to give the above paragraphs a cursory edit? Has this improvement/performance been a cumulative effect over the various upgraded versions during the 15 years (in other words has the training been transferred from version to version), or even since the time period when you said you had to retrain your custom vocabulary? I'm 41 but still somewhat impatient and I'd hate to think that I'd be 56 before this program works as well as your above post seems to indicate:) One last question and I'll leave you alone for awhile. Your opinion: Do you know or think that the Professional version performs much better than the Standard or Preferred versions? Thanks

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

slgraycols - Am a bit jammed with deadlines, today. Pls bear with and I'll cobble together a cogent reply for ya, hopefully before the weekend expires.
BTW, I am 57, ya young whippersnapper. If you can stand a Runesage observation re your learning curve concern - in hindsight, there are a helluva lot of things I should have begun doing back then so I'd be a helluva lot gooder at 'em by now! :-)

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

Runesage, thanks a lot, I understand busyness and am grateful for any observations, especially as any response is totally voluntary and kind considering the time constraints people have nowadays. I'm not in a huge rush to get Dragon as I really have only begun considering it again after reading your first post in this topic. I discounted the speech recognition software after my short experiences with ViaVoice and XP's built in capabilities. The time spent training just seems daunting but I suppose if I don't start now, in 15 years it'll still be untrained and personally, for many reasons I'll probably need it and appreciate it more then than I do now :) And I love and prefer hindsight observations, and the things one would do differently, especially over long periods of time. Those are the ones we can really learn from. A lot of software reviews I've found seem to be after only a short period of use and this speech recognition software is just seems so much more involved than that. I've favorited this topic and will check back...Ciao and thanks again

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

>>>How long did it take using this program for things to become second nature?<<<

When I first started using Dragon, I was cranking out several articles per day and thus it wasn't long before I was "in the groove." However, as my business diversified, I spent less time dictating and more time using design and graphics products and my proficiency declined. Everyone's going to experience a different learning curve depending on frequency of use, their natural speech patterns (enunciation), vocabulary size, and primary usage (dictating pure text versus dictating numbers into spreadsheets versus dictating a combination such as recipes or mailing lists). Today's faster computers help, too, as will having the right microphone and the effect of all the sound-related stuff such as how to position the mike next to your mouth, ambient office noise, how much time you take with initial training, whether you take extra time to let it scan existing writing and have you train with that, too, etc. etc. etc.

>>>I am assuming you have upgraded often. How long did it take you to train Dragon to perform well enough that you only had to give the above paragraphs a cursory edit?<<<

Thought I'd mentioned... I tend to leapfrog over as many upgrades as possible to save money, so I've only upgraded 3 times. Initial training goes very quickly, and the ongoing training takes place automatically, i.e. any changes and corrections you make during every session are stored at the end of the session. Whenever you close Dragon, it asks if you want to save changes to speech files. I always say yes. In actuality, its really you who's being trained (learning commands and improving your own dictation skills). The software's recognition algorithms and usability just keep getting better and better. While I now use version 7, I've read that version 9 is far better. I do hope they never obsolete old speech files again!

>>>Has this improvement/performance been a cumulative effect over the various upgraded versions during the 15 years (in other words has the training been transferred from version to version), or even since the time period when you said you had to retrain your custom vocabulary?<<<

There are three types of improvement to performance-
a) the minor cumulative improvement in speed as the systems' dictionaries expand (understand that there are 2 types of dictionaries... words themselves and how each word is parsed/spoken) because that reduces the amount of stop/start for training/correcting.
b) more significant improvements that come from faster PC processing and the version upgrades
c) self-proficiency, as your brain, mouth (and hand on mouse) begin to function as a "team". For example, as I dictated that last sentence, I noticed that the phrase "function as a" was incorrectly displayed as "function as they". My hand moved the mouse over "they" and I changed it to "I" without even thinking about it. Now, a novice might have felt inconvenienced by having to stop, say the command "select function as they", redictate it and then pick up where he left off. This doesn't mean I don't get frustrated. If this were real AI, the software would detect a change in my tone and grovel an apology, but we're not there, yet. I want a bootlicking lackey and I want it now!

>>>One last question and I'll leave you alone for awhile. Your opinion: Do you know or think that the Professional version performs much better than the Standard or Preferred versions? Thanks<<<

I honestly can't comment on the professional version. It costs over five times as much, and for the life of me I don't know what improvements could be worth that much... unless it comes with its own bootlicking lackey!

TIP: If you install Dragon, I recommend setting it up with a floating DragonBar instead of a docked bar (TOOLS>OPTIONS>VIEW), because when I first launched this new Dragon (in WinXP), the default docked bar at the top of the screen threw my desktop icons out of kilter.

Note: They suggest using DragonPad (TOOLS>DRAGONPAD) rather than Win Notepad or the Win WordPad. It's essentially the same as WordPad, but they claim it's better integrated.

A review of Professional: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1996721,00.asp
Nifty Video: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2704,1997294,00.asp

The PCMag reviewer recommended the cheapest "Standard" version, but I seem to recall a significant difference in either quality or options between it and Preferred for very little extra cost. Maybe that's no longer the case. You'll have to research that.

Google Results: http://tinyurl.com/2ftcl6

Hope this helps you make an informed decision. As I said earlier, I think it's a great appl. even though I just noticed one Dragon typo in the body of this message that I didn't catch when I was dictating or giving it the once over proof. Bet there are one or two others. Anyone complaining about that just doesn't get it.

Posted 16 years ago #
gameboy007
Member

Everybody talks about their experiences of Dragon...can anybody here send me a file (.exe)
of the software?...i also want to experience it...wanna try the good stuff...pls?
if you can't send me the file...just PM me and give me the link where you downloaded it...thank you.

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

It is unethical to pass around executables of copyrighted product. I've never heard of Nuance/ScanSoft offering a free trial, and didn't find one in the top Google page hits... but you might try Googling for it anyway.

I did, however, find a place that's offering Dragon v9 for $70, 20 bucks less than through Staples; but have no idea how legit the seller (bargainstation) is nor how many copies are available. Note that the $70 was for the "standard" version.

They're also selling the "preferred" for $160, which, by the way, was the price I paid some 15 years ago for my first copy! Back then it didn't have nearly the number of features or as powerful a speech engine, and the dollar was actually worth something, making this version a pretty good buy IMHO. -
http://www.bargainstation.com/35972.html
http://www.bargainstation.com/36333.html

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

slgraycols-
Here's a video demoing Dragon Pro (the expensive version):
http://www.voicerecognition.com.au/dragon_naturallyspeaking_demo.html

This video offers a pretty honest look at how a proficient user can hop between various appls without touching the keys. The aussie's accent didn't faze the speech engine. Note that Dragon's now claiming it'll handle almost any "windows-based" application, whereas in earlier versions, the most they'd claim was it would work within Word and Excel.

Posted 16 years ago #
BuBBy
Teh adnim

The demos tend to be more of the "watch" type, and not the "use" type.
http://www.nuance.com/naturallyspeaking/demos/

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

Bubby, I thought I'd included that link a couple posts ago. Guess I didn't drill down far enough into all the browswer windows I had on my screen and overlooked it. Thanks!

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

Hi, I am sorry about the belated reply to your post. I actually read your reply earlier but time goes by so quick and I hadn't had the time to view the demos and thank you for taking time to post it. So I officially do thank you!!

I do want to apologize though as I didn't intend for you to have to do my research. But I do appreciate the links you provided, especially the video links, and especially the one with the Australian accent. That one was pretty cool. I hadn't actually found the Pcmag links nor the Bargain Station site.

I had only asked for your opinion about the pro version because it was indicated in your 1st post that you were using Dragon Pro, but the way some companies title their products nowadays, what had been called 'Pro' before probably isn't any longer. I had looked up the Pro version on Nuance's website and read about it but never got as far as researching the actual cost. I zoomed right in on it in Pcmag's article and it is listed at $899 so I don't think I'll be using that particular version. I had figured maybe a $50 or so cost difference (maybe when GAOTD gets a bit bigger we can put this software on our wish list.) I did read on the Nuance site that the Pro version was hands free (even certified for people with disabilities) so I thought that would have been the best version to have but the price is out of my range (even if it were to come with it's own bootlicking lackey!) Though I really would consider paying that much if it could read my mind and transfer the thoughts to paper. I have found out that my library system is purchasing several copies of the standard version so I may be able to test before buying. Then I will most likely look to ebay to find a better price for the standard version, or keep an eye on slickdeals to see if any specials come up.

I did find out the basic difference between the versions. At the end of the pcmag article the reviewer states: "Do you need the Professional version? Maybe. It's the only version that automatically integrates with a wide variety of software apps. The Preferred version integrates with only Word and Excel, the Standard with only Word. But for most users, that's the only significant difference. Unless you're deploying the app across a corporation or building a highly specialized business or academic vocabulary, you'll be fine with the Preferred or Standard version."
I guess I will be fine with the standard version for the cost. I was more worried about the difference in performance (like 80% vs 90% vs 95% accuracy, which is what I feared the the difference in versions would be) And here is a link to a chart (if you haven't already seen it) on Nuance's site that compares the 3 versions. http://www.nuance.com/naturallyspeaking/matrix/professional/
It doesn't seem as if there are any performance differences mainly just differences in features.

Thank you again for all your insightful information. This sounds like exciting software and thanks to your review above I am excited about voice recognition again, even though I know it will take some work. Nuance should hire you for a spokesperson! Ciao

Oh and thanks also to Bubby also for the link!

Posted 16 years ago #
slgraycols
Member

Face or Runesage or anyone interested, It's not free but since we'll probably never get it free, buy.com has Nuance Dragon NaturallySpeaking v.9.0 StandardPC for $42.50 with free shipping ($32.50 with Google Checkout) As far as I can tell this is the complete version, not just an upgrade. And I don't see that it requires any rebates.

http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=202866579&adid=17070&dcaid=17070

Posted 16 years ago #
RunesageMagik
Member

Thanks, but it's important to differentiate between the different versions and version numbers. That's an offer for the Dragon STANDARD version. Most agree that the Dragon PREFERRED version is far superior, and there's also Dragon PRO version, unaffordable for most of us commoners.

Still, it's definitely an attractive starter version, priced right for someone who wants to get their feet wet (especially since I think it's Vista-certified); but, Nuance has already released V9.5.

A caveat... reportedly, if you buy the V9 STANDARD, you won't be able to upgrade to V10 when it comes out. That's the same beef I had long ago. I spent ages building Vx's vocabulary, then they come out with the Vx+1 and I couldn't migrate. To say the least, I was well and truly miffed. [Don't misunderstand me, all my creative work product wasn't lost, just the voice training and custom dictionaries]

http://labnol.blogspot.com/2006/08/dragon-naturallyspeaking-9-vs-windows.html
http://www.nuance.com/vista/
Video Tutorial - http://www.speechcomputing.com/node/1683
http://www.spectronicsinoz.com/product.asp?product=24125
V9.5 Hardware requirements - http://www.voicerecognition.com.au/dragon_hints_tips.htm
http://www.voicerecognition.com.au/dragon_faq.htm

Posted 16 years ago #

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