make yur posts short, sharp and sweet. i don't like reading loooooong posts
[closed]
Forum Posted LINK Color and HTML Tag issues.....
(59 posts) (8 voices)-
Face
Memberalexiussg:
Appreciate your input (although discussion on topic is another approach!)- different strokes for different folks, and all.
BigThunder1:
I understand your frustration with the obvious lack of input from the PTB here, but I can't agree that they are unresponsive to our concerns. There is ample evidence that they monitor discussions and take action where needed - and I can sympathise with the need to stay generally uninvolved in the actual discussions. Imagine the outrage if administrators were seen to participate in some discussions more than others, much less, a perception to be "taking sides" in an ongoing debate; or if promises - implied or stated - were made and circumstances (or a higher authority) dictated that those promises would not/or could not be implemented after all.
I think there are enough instances of rude responses, personal insults and off-topic ramblings, which result in misunderstandings and hurt feelings to justify the absence of actual input from the PTB until we, the members of this community, begin to excercise the level of restraint and self-control necessary to participate here as mature adults. (I submit, for comparison, recent postings here: http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=174636) While I agree that postings here in the forums are a huge improvement over what goes on in the site comments, I think we have a way to go, before we can expect that level of participation.
I, personally, appreciate the frequent input and helpful advice from both Lee and BuBBy and trust that our concerns are conveyed appropriately to the PTB.
Posted 17 years ago # -
Archangel
MemberWell here I go again.
@Face
I don't understand your position on what it will take to get more response from GOTD (that does not include BuBBy and Lee, they do an excellent job but they are very limited on what the can and can't do).
You stated the following to BigThunder1: "While I agree that postings here in the forums are a huge improvement over what goes on in the site comments, I think we have a way to go, before we can expect that level of participation."
I have been involved with many forums and admin'd on a couple. My experience has been that the staff directs the flow and topics however they want them to go so I agree with BigThunder1. "Silence" isn't always golden. No one expects them to change things at the slightest whelm of a member but at least look at the situation.
Now getting down to the nut cut'n, I'm a retired Chief of Police. I say exactly what I mean or how I feel. (yes BigThunder1, thats my problem besides being a southern boy too). What would my Officers had done if I didn't address any problem that presented itself? Everything had to be addressed for a smooth running dept. In this case, this website.
And while I'm on the topic, I have scolded a couple here in this forum. It was meant to make them think about what happened. Unfortunatly it didn't work with one member because she went to another forum and directed them right back here! LOL oh well I tried.
Thanks for listening GOTD, members and new friends.
Posted 17 years ago # -
Face
MemberArchangel:
What I'm saying (or trying to, at least) is that any direct input from Admin here would be open to misunderstanding, hurt feelings and/or attack, if the answer weren't to the members' liking or hit them when they were tired or in a bad mood - which could then disintegrate into outright warfare. While that is unfortunate between equals (members), I think it could be disasterous when engaged in by one who holds power over the others. For example (hypothetical case!):
MemberA: We've been discussing the need for a color change in the links posted in this Forum and I think it's about time we had an answer! Is anyone listening?!?
PTB1: We appreciate the input of all of our fine members and have taken the matter under advisement; we wish to express our gratitude to all who participated in this lively discussion.
MemberB: What does "under advisement" mean?
MemberA: I'll tell you what it means - it means they're not giving us a straight answer - that's what it means!
MemberB: You mean they won't change the color?
MemberC: Who cares about the color - it's the underlining that's the problem. I hate when there's no underlne - you can never find what you are looking for.
PTB1: I apologise for any misunderstanding the previous post may have engendered. We are researching alternative means of conveyance and anticipate early resolution. As always, your input is greatly appreciated.
MemberB: What does "engendered" mean?
MemberC: Screw "engendered," WTF does "conveyance" mean?
MemberA: I'll tell you what it means! It means they think we're stupid! They just don't care what we think or want anyway - There's no point in suggesting stuff here - it will never change - They just don't care what we want!
MemberC: Does that mean we won't get the underlines either?
MemberA: Will you shut up about the stupid underlines!?! Don't you get it - they aren't listening!
PTB2: Please be patient. We are working on the problem.
MemberA: Oh, I'm sure!! It's been 3 hours and nothing has changed - What's it going to take? - a MUTINY??
MemberB: I want the color changed, but I could never participate in a mutiny - count me out.
MemberC: Is the mutiny just about color or can you be in it if you want the underlines?
MemberA: If I hear one more time about the friggin' underlines ...
PTB1: After considerable research and market-testing we have determined that switching the color from green to red would be advantageous. The change will be implemented tomorrow. Thank you all for your continued interest in this topic.
MemberB: That's great! I love red!
MemberA: Red!?! That's nuts!! I thought we voted for Blue? And what's with the wait? Too busy to press a few keys today, PTB?
MemberC: I thought they were going to make underlines.
MemberA: I've HAD IT with you and your damned UNDERLINES!! Get out of this Forum and don't come back, you little Twit!
MemberB: Who are you to say who can post here - You're nothing but a big bully! Admin ...? Can he kick someone off here?
Admin: I've had it with all of you selfish little Brats! This Topic is closed! No, as a matter of fact, this whole Forum is closed. The He_ _ with all of you!!
Archangel:
That's kind of what I meant ...They can make effective changes without direct participation in the Forums.
Alexiussg:
Apologies for the long post.Posted 17 years ago # -
Archangel
MemberThanks for the sample thread Face. I do understand your point on there ablity to make changes without any input but I don't think all members are thin skinned (a few are though) and would fall out because they didn't get there way. Its only suggestions. Its GOTD's site and they can do whatever they want. In fact they always have and always will.
My appoligies also alexiussg.
BuBBy, my hats off to you and Lee. You guys do a great job being more than just a moderator. You guys are also the buffer. Maybe its good, maybe not.
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
Member@ Face:
Ya know,... I was going to post a response to all this and attempt to explain my position/take on things, but it's obvious your very cynical about all this as well as intimidated by the PTB across the board. How do you think anything gets done or changed? It's called communication and sometimes it doesn't go as hoped. Dissension and disappointment is a given at times, but I really don't think most others are quite that petty and realize, as Archangle said, that GOTD can do anything they want with their site regardless of our opinion.
You said:
I understand your frustration with the obvious lack of input from the PTB here, but I can't agree that they are unresponsive to our concerns. There is ample evidence that they monitor discussions and take action where needed - and I can sympathise with the need to stay generally uninvolved in the actual discussions. Imagine the outrage if administrators were seen to participate in some discussions more than others, much less, a perception to be "taking sides" in an ongoing debate; or if promises - implied or stated - were made and circumstances (or a higher authority) dictated that those promises would not/or could not be implemented after all.You don't understand the frustration, and I never once said they haven't made changes or concessions. They wouldn't be taking sides, they'd be directly involved in the debate, and for that, in return would receive quality feed back and ideas 'in an adult like manner', which brings me to the second point I want to make here related to the rest of your post.
I think there are enough instances of rude responses, personal insults and off-topic ramblings, which result in misunderstandings and hurt feelings to justify the absence of actual input from the PTB until we, the members of this community, begin to excercise the level of restraint and self-control necessary to participate here as mature adults. (I submit, for comparison, recent postings here: http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=174636) While I agree that postings here in the forums are a huge improvement over what goes on in the site comments, I think we have a way to go, before we can expect that level of participation.
You have insulted me and no doubt a number of other members by insinuating we're a bunch of rude, insulting, and rambling idiots that don't have the wherewithal to maintain our composure in a discussion/debate with the PTB and are not worthy of even having an opinion, let alone stating one. I'll cut this short here because you don't want me to continue, and I really am not going to turn this thread into a peeing contest about maturity. If you sit in the shadows all your life that's where you'll always reside and nothing will ever get done. I'm not a passive type that's going to sit by while others walk all over me. It would appear that you are by your own comments, and therefor will gain little ground if any because of it outside of pure luck.
I, personally, appreciate the frequent input and helpful advice from both Lee and BuBBy and trust that our concerns are conveyed appropriately to the PTB.
I second that. But the fact remains, that regardless weather the PTB use them as a buffer or not is irrelevant! The point is, there has been no response on the subject and many others brought up in these forums ...even through the moderators! I appreciate what they do, and it's not an easy job, but sometimes you just can't hide behind the curtains and expect something to just fall magically into place without speaking up. They do their job by passing on the message, but then when no response comes back their job becomes twice difficult by having to deal with attitudes that build by being ignored. Then eventually it comes out here and may appear rude or insulting at first until one takes the time to understand why these attitudes came about in the first place, which you obviously haven't taken the time to understand. Therefor, no, you don't understand and never will as long as you sit on your backside and wait for the PTB to figure things out for themselves.
Ya know, I can be diplomatic and nice, but when I have to deal with someone that insults me and is little minded about why these forums exist, then no amount of words can make that person understand what's being discussed and why. If that's your attitude, then why do you even post anything or voice an opinion?
Now, can we get back on focus and topic, thank you.
@ Archangel:
I appreciate your position in the matter and stepping up here.
@ alexiussg:
Sometimes one can't get the message across or clarify their point in a matter of one or two sentences or paragraphs. I will not apologize for the length of my posts if I feel it necessary to anyone. I'm sorry they boar you to the point you felt it necessary to comment. Sometimes short and sweet just doesn't convey the depth of the point.
Posted 17 years ago # -
Face
MemberBigThunder1:
Thank you for your revealing response. I appreciate your comments, but I assure you, very little intimidates me, including the PTB and yourself.
Please note that in my posts, I never once stated or implied that anything I said pertained specifically to you or to anyone else, for that matter, or that you were "not worthy of even having an opinion, let alone stating one." (your words)
Actually, I made the point of including myself in the criticism, "I think we have a way to go ..." (my words) in contrast to the personal attacks in your own posts:
"it's obvious your (sic) very cynical about all this as well as intimidated by the PTB across the board," and ...
"I'm not a passive type that's going to sit by while others walk all over me. It would appear that you are by your own comments, and therefor will gain little ground if any because of it outside of pure luck." and ...
" ...until one takes the time to understand why these attitudes came about in the first place, which you obviously haven't taken the time to understand. Therefor, no, you don't understand and never will as long as you sit on your backside and wait for the PTB to figure things out for themselves." and finally ...
"You have insulted me and no doubt a number of other members by insinuating we're a bunch of rude, insulting, and rambling idiots that don't have the wherewithal to maintain our composure in a discussion/debate with the PTB ..."
My intention was never to insult anyone, and if that is the way it was taken, I apologise to all. I was simply using humor to illustrate what might happen if the discussion were to include the PTB.
But please, BigThunder1, get a grip! We're talking about which color of type stands out best, in contrast to the black!
Although I thank you for illustrating my point.
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberOh how interesting. You can take partial comments at random from my reply/post and twist them in an attempt to make your point. Your words here speak for themselves, and my comments reflect that. Get a grip indeed.
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberAnyone that can read will see your attempt, as well as understand why my reply was such.
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberOK, obviously you can't or won't except the truth within these comments. Re-read the posts above and answer your own questions. I don't have interest in dragging this out because you are adamant to make your point which, was to take a passive stance to all this and justify ignorance of the PTB relative to these discussions. I will not further feed your ego with any more replies related to your and my comments above. This is being taken completely out of context and isn't the reason I started this thread in the first place. I simply responded to your comment (as have others here) and you refuse to let it go. As I stated earlier, I'm not going to get into a peeing contest which is exactly what your attempting to do to justify your self and comments. Enough said on the subject. Lick your wounds and let's get on with the original discussion this thread was started about to begin with.
Posted 17 years ago # -
Face
MemberAs was evident earlier, you have totally misunderstood what I have said, if you believe this:
"...because you are adamant to make your point which, was to take a passive stance to all this and justify ignorance of the PTB relative to these discussions."
Neither my stance is passive, nor do I believe the PTB are ignorant of these discussions. I don't know where you got that idea. I was merely pointing out why they may choose not to particpate directly, which has been well illustrated. And thank you for your concern, but I have no wounds.
I agree, the best place for this to go - is back to the original discussion. So here is my vote: Bright blue, with an underline the disappears under mouse hover.
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberFace's vote:
So here is my vote: Bright blue, with an underline the disappears under mouse hover.
My vote:
I'm in total agreement with Face's vote. However, I'd be just as pleased if the color remained green as is (I personally prefer blue) and contained the visual link underline that disappears upon mouse-over / hover as Face suggest. Seems we're all on the same page here with our desire. Let's hope the GOTD PTB will except and make change in this regard for all. I don't think this would be a difficult task or that we're asking too much.
@ Face:
Quote;
My intention was never to insult anyone, and if that is the way it was taken, I apologise to all. I was simply using humor to illustrate what might happen if the discussion were to include the PTB.Apology accepted. Try to re-read your posts as though they were written by someone else and you were seeing them for the first time. There's absolutely no humor about them, and to the majority they are insulting in their implication. A handshake and a wave and we're on our way again. ;)
Regards...
Posted 17 years ago # -
Archangel
MemberThis is actually reflecting on another thread titled as "Blame".
First I'd like to say that even though there has been exchanges in ideas and even jousts, this is very healthy. Several members took things for the way they were typed. If a moderator had simply "Closed" the thread, there may have been completely incorrect feelings between members. Fortunatly now everyone is completely straight on the matter.
In other threads I've been described as "snappy", "arogant" (hehehe I forget the rest) so even if you were insulting or including me in to ........why.........The PTB don't respond, it really doesn't matter. I know they come and read there very own forum and don't need BuBBy to forward request to them.
What made alot of members "ticked" was the fact of the Morpheus Photo whatever "extra goodies* that were included. (and don't think there wasn't malware there because I disassembled it myself). To Date, there hasn't been a response from the site owners. Since this site can't operate without having people come and download software wouldn't you think that a "I'm sorry, it got past us" would surfice? Thats the point Face. BuBBy shouldn't have had to be a buffer on that. Just a simple "I'm sorry folks" would have made the members happy.
Just another rambling from a rude, insulting, and rambling idiot. ROTFLMAO
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberThe troops arrrrrre restless! ...LOL Whatta ya gonna do? I wonder if the PTB own stock in any major headache pill suppliers! Think I'll hang around just to see what's gonna happen next. ;)
Posted 17 years ago # -
Face
MemberArchangel:
Thanks for your latest reply; I'm glad that you, BuBBy and the others I've heard from appreciate the obvious humor in some of my contributions to this forum!
Thanks, also, for the clarification provided in your most recent post:
"What made alot of members "ticked" was the fact of the Morpheus Photo whatever "extra goodies* that were included."
My comments on the 'lack of participation' by the PTB pertained only to threads such as this, which addressed the problems of "... Posted LINK Color and HTML Tag issues," and continued over several days. As noted earlier in this thread, many administrators or staff of other sites tightly control the flow of discussions in their forums, whereas here, contributers are given substantial freedom in what and how they post, which I, personally, greatly appreciate. Another way to interpret the lack of participation by the PTB could be that they acknowledge our ability to make our desires known without the need for constant supervision and postings from administrators. So they monitor the discussions, let us have our say, consider input from the moderators (Thanks Lee and BuBBy)and make what changes they deem appropriate, in response. What more do we really need?
As for the Morpheus Photo disaster - I wholeheartedly agree with you that some sort of response, in the form of an explanation, acknowledgement of responsiblity or apology by administrators here and/or representatives of the software company would have been appreciated by visitors to this site, whether they had been directly affected or not. In choosing not to reply, they must accept the ultimate consequences of their silence.
Posted 17 years ago # -
Archangel
MemberThanks for your reply also Face. I feel that the admins failure to respond to that situation compound on all the rest. Like a snowball that starts rolling down a hill. The farther it goes, the bigger it gets.
hehehehe We (you and I) wasn't on the same page either LOL. This thread is a perfect example that we are not all children with tempers and can work things out ourselves. In fact, I'm very impressed with the knowledge of alot of members that post in this forum. They are from all walks of life but have a common interest and goal. I can even tell by phrases and the way you post that you are no stranger to forums. I've noticed it also with some of the others too.
I do have one problem with you though and it concerns your username. That was a nickname that I gave my first wife! LOL Now if your female, I know who you are and next time you can pay the daughters auto insurance (she's 27). ROTFLMAO
Take care everyone,
ArchangelPosted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberGentlemen, I think we've all made some valid points here. There's an underlying atmosphere about this site that needs attention by the PTB in some form and I think this thread as well as many others are a perfect example of the tension that exists, created by a lack of response to some issues that shouldn't have been ignored (or at least left with that impression), and what appears to be a biased and unfair practice of moderation on the main page. The main page comment area is what should be "tightly controlled" by the admin to maintain an air of professionalism because it is the first impression one gets when visiting this site for the first time. With all the petty personal comments and randomly poor filtering of such, this leaves a bad first impression and comes off more often than not as though it is a romper room daycare rather than a professionally managed feedback forum/commentary for what's being offered.
The 'Morpheus Photo disaster' I agree was the straw that broke the camels back and escalated an already compounding atmosphere of aggravation that is a combination of my above point and lack of the "tight control" Face referred to. This IMO is where the problem started. By filtering out petty irrelevant commentation to begin with, and admins direct or indirect (through the moderators) response to real issues and concerns, that air of professionalism would have flowed over into these forums and as nature would have it, the petty whiners etc. would have been left behind or eventually filtered out through ignoring them.
Face, there have been so many here that have taken the 'sit back' 'it's free' 'don't complain' attitude/approach that I put you in this same category when first reading your post.
You stated:
I think there are enough instances of rude responses, personal insults and off-topic ramblings, which result in misunderstandings and hurt feelings to justify the absence of actual input from the PTB until we, the members of this community, begin to excercise the level of restraint and self-control necessary to participate here as mature adults. (I submit, for comparison, recent postings here: http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=174636) While I agree that postings here in the forums are a huge improvement over what goes on in the site comments, I think we have a way to go, before we can expect that level of participation.Since you addressed that post to me personally, I took it as such. Your statement referenced directly above here is what set me off in combination with your following comment/example-thread and was viewed as a personal attack since your overall comment was addressed to me in reference to my posted statement at the bottom of page one to this thread. You furthered that insult with your follow up post and the hypothetical sample thread you posed as an example to your point before I had a chance to respond to your address. I understand the point you were trying to make overall, yet you must understand your initial address to me made it personal. Outside that, I think we're all basically on the same page. And if you consider my opening comment related to the main page and it's moderation management, I think you'll see why these issues and complaints are such to begin with. They have come to be as a direct result of this management practice, and all have become weary of this. Myself included.
The lack of communication and poor main page moderation practices have created an atmosphere of rampant and uncontrolled professionalism, which as such, has been brought on by the PTB and their seeming lack of response to the numerous complaints registered in those regards and not taking a firmer stance to the front door and it's impression on new as well as old members/visitors. We are all guilty of complaining at various times here as our patience runs thin with these issues and the desire to see this site bloom into what I think we all want, ...and that is a well organized and professional operation we can all feel proud to be a part of. Not a babysitting romper room of dissent and degradation that is the impression one is left with here after very little time invested looking over things and responses, or lack thereof.
Archangle made a good point when he said " This thread is a perfect example that we are not all children with tempers and can work things out ourselves. " . This is because those that are 'children with tempers' are only interested in their own personal wants and desires, and therefor don't venture into threads/discussions of this nature related to the site itself with the desire to smooth and improve for the betterment of all, unlike those of us here now.
I rest my case and hope you understand how and why things got a little heated and personal here. I have nothing against you or anyone here personally, and I think we're all big enough to move on with an understanding of what happened and why. So again, I accept your apology for what came off as a personal attack by addressing your comment(s) to me directly, and again offer you a handshake and a wave so we can move on to bigger and better things and set an example to others less tempered.
Regards...
Posted 17 years ago # -
Face
MemberNow Angel,
You know all that was ironed out in the divorce papers we both signed - I put up half the money when our dear daughter originally purchased that car and you agreed to pay for her insurance.
So dont't try to squirm out of it now, honey - a deal is a deal, my former love.
Face
P.S. I'm glad to see that you're making some new friends here - now ya'll take care!
Posted 17 years ago # -
That... was an interesting thread.
By the way, Firefox users can easily stamp out the effects of the blink tag no matter where it is - just open your userContent.css file (various places have instructions or even add-ons for this) and add this line:
blink { text-decoration: none !important; }
And the dirt... is goooone~.
*cough*
By the way, similar applies for marquee:
marquee { -moz-binding : none !important; display : block; height : auto !important; }Posted 17 years ago # -
Archangel
Member@Face........Well now I know your not the Ex. She wouldn't put up half of anything unless it was her best friends husband!! Then she gave him all!! LOL Also she wouldn't have worded the reply the way you did either...............
Thanks for being nice and keeping a good humor.
Archangel
PS BigThunder1 isn't a "dude" ROTFLMAO
Posted 17 years ago # -
pauloparra
MemberOh man,
This looks soo cool. You guys in this thread that suggested this changes were righ on the spot. Kudos to the moderators for listening and asking the PTB. Kudos as well to the PTB for listening.
Thanks,
-Mario
Posted 17 years ago # -
BigThunder1
MemberWell! This is a pleasant surprise and I'm smilein' from ear to ear!! :) I was busy and didn't have time to get here yesterday. I'd like to thank the following folks for imputing there two cents and ideas into this thread/subject up to this point;
BuBBy
Jucati
alexiussg
Keilaron
Archangel
Face
(The list is simply in order of each participating members first post to this thread copied from the opening comment through to this one. There is no meaning to the order outside that process.)Face said;
Amazing what can be accomplished when you put a few good heads together!
Couldn't have summed it up better Face. While I'm at it, thanks for the compliment referring to initiating this thread/subject! ;)
pauloparra said;
This looks soo cool. You guys in this thread that suggested this changes were righ on the spot.
Thank you pauloparra!
Archangel said;
PS BigThunder1 isn't a "dude" ROTFLMAO
I'd rather be called a "Dude" than a "Dudette"! ...LOL
How right you are though referring to the dictionary definition of the term. ;) Although I can dress and fit in with the best of 'em if and when called for, I prefer to be layed back and comfortable like the country boy I was raised as. That said, you can call me 'Dude', ...just please don't call me late for dinner! :o
And last, but not least;
Thank you Slava and the GOTD team and staff members (the PTB) for following this conversation and implementing the ideas and fixes discussed and suggested here. The blue color choice with underline of URL links has greatly improved the look of the forum and will make links stand out and easier to search for when browsing, no doubt adding a more upbeat energetic atmosphere for all. Blue is an empowering color verses green which is a passive color, and I think portrays a stronger yet still lighthearted business look and feel to the site overall compared to it's previous look. The underlines increase link awareness for those with monitors that are improperly color calibrated as well (as Jucati suggested could be an issue for some). I also thank those that were responsible for fixing the 'blockquote' tag. The offset provides a much more professional looking form than simply (em)phasizing the text of an intended quote.
There's been a lot of accusations of ignorance and unawareness by the GOTD PTB in the forum and elsewhere. This thread should be a reference for all that this 'in fact' is not the case, and I'm sure will make all here realize and appreciate what you folks do here that much more. I personally feel privileged to have been a part of this topic and the resulting actions derived from it.
I'm sure I speak for all when I say ...THANK YOU! for allowing us to have a voice here at GOTD, ...and listening to it. :)
Posted 17 years ago #
Topic Closed
This topic has been closed to new replies.